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Thread: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

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    Default What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    I'm of the impression that "Big Poppa Pump" Scott Steiner's WWE run didn't work because Vince wanted him to be more of a competitive in-ring wrestler like he used to be from his Steiner Brothers heyday from 1989-1994, even though Scott had well-documented back issues that caused him to finally go under the knife in 1999 where he had steel rods implanted in his back from three ruptured back disks. But it was his drop foot injury that limited him since the final days of WCW in 2001, and he couldn't be the wrestler Vince hoped he was getting when Scott did endless suplexes, botched moves and even certain fans remember him for falling off the ring apron. Vince expecting Steiner to be the in-ring wrestler he used to be but no longer was, definitely was the biggest factor in Vince miscasting Steiner (as BPP) as a face character, just another example of Vince and WWE being too afraid to give Steiner a live microphone! Unscripted, uncensored and unfiltered shoot promos are where most of Steiner's mic work skills come from. To make him do WWE-style scripted promos is so far out of Steiner's comfort zone in promos. Same thing can easily apply to Kevin Nash too, although Nash was more of an unscripted witty cutting edge promo cutter, while Steiner was more of a total off-script promo cutter.

    If only Vince understood or had the realization that the Scott Steiner that returned to WWE in 2002 isn't the same Scott Steiner that left the WWF in 1994, maybe he would've been in a better position to succeed like Hogan, Flair, Nash, Goldberg and Booker T did, and maybe Sting and DDP would have been successful. Too bad WWE and Vince expected Steiner to be anything else besides his Big Poppa Pump character that he created in 1998 (with a little help from Bischoff and Hogan). Maybe Scott Steiner's behind-the-scenes issues with Ric Flair, DDP and Torrie Wilson could've hurt him more than his drop foot injury, but I think the RAW brand already had Triple H as their designated #1 heel in 2003. Some say being on the SmackDown! brand could've helped mask Steiner's drop foot injury and his limited mobility with matches like Kurt Angle, Eddie Guerrero, Brock Lesnar and The Undertaker, but Vince didn't want him on SmackDown!.

    Vince wanted Steiner on RAW because RAW was looked at as the star-driven soap opera storyline-centric WWE brand, while SD! was the WWE brand that catered a little more to in-ring abilities, and because Steiner was one of WCW's top stars during WCW's final years. That explains why Steiner was assigned to the RAW brand, where he was given two title shots at the WWE World Heavyweight Championship Belt versus Triple H in his first two PPV match outings, where the Royal Rumble 2003 crowd turned against Steiner. Not only did Steiner was plagued with his drop foot injury, but I think Triple H was also limited due to him having put on so much muscle mass to overcompensate for his torn quadriceps in 2001 that sidelined him for the entire WWF InVasion storyline. Still, most of the blame in their two matches went to Steiner for not being the wrestler that he used to be in 1989-1994 that Vince wanted him to be, plus Scott wasn't going to do anymore of his high-flying moves at 40, and WWE demonstrated his weaknesses more.

    It's clear Vince didn't want Scott Steiner doing unfiltered, unscripted and uncensored promos like he did from 1998-2001 just because it's based on his late 1990s/early 2000s backstage reputation from WCW, as well as the fact that Steiner's Big Poppa Pump persona was considered a WCW creation, much like the New World Order (nWo) faction was a WCW creation; since The Steiner Brothers had two WWF Tag Team Championship reigns in 1993. Plus, the main event scene in WWE required most of their main eventers to work big matches with WWE's Box Office main-event style moveset for more than 10 minutes, which was impossible for the likes of Kevin Nash, Scott Steiner or even Goldberg to do.

    After leaving WWE in 2004, Scott Steiner finally had surgery for his drop foot injury via bone graft from his hip; and once he was ready to return in 2006, I think Scott Steiner went on to revitalize his declining wrestling career in TNA where he had occasional flashes of his old high flying moveset like the Frankensteiner off the top rope, only saved for PPV matches; plus, I think TNA allowed Scott Steiner to be himself on the mic for promos like WCW did. Something WWE wasn't going to do since WWE is a corporate public company as opposed to the private family owned company they were prior to 1999 when WWF was going to go public based on the popularity of Steve Austin and The Rock for The Attitude Era.

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    Given A 2nd Chance Blindy's Avatar

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    1) Ric Flair's detest of Steiner going back to WCW rubbed onto Triple H and it was never going to work right than and there. It's the same reason DDP never got to breathe when he came over from WCW, Flair had Vince and HHH's ears at that point and neither were ever liked by Flair by both's accounts. Steiner didn't have the backstage politics game he had in the Russo WCW. It didn't matter how well the fans loved Steiner or if he could put butts in the seat, at this time Triple H didn't have the business mentality he has now where he can let bygones be bygones and suck it up for the better of the product(Bret Hart a prime example).

    2) Injuries he compounded from the wear and tear in Japan, and WCW led to a immobile Steiner at the time he signed with the WWE. The feud with Test was embarrassing for both guys. You had to really work with Steiner and allow him to get his power shots and make it a slow enough match that doesn't make Steiner look like a fish out of water.
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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blindy View Post
    1) Ric Flair's detest of Steiner going back to WCW rubbed onto Triple H and it was never going to work right than and there. It's the same reason DDP never got to breathe when he came over from WCW, Flair had Vince and HHH's ears at that point and neither were ever liked by Flair by both's accounts. Steiner didn't have the backstage politics game he had in the Russo WCW. It didn't matter how well the fans loved Steiner or if he could put butts in the seat, at this time Triple H didn't have the business mentality he has now where he can let bygones be bygones and suck it up for the better of the product(Bret Hart a prime example).

    2) Injuries he compounded from the wear and tear in Japan, and WCW led to a immobile Steiner at the time he signed with the WWE. The feud with Test was embarrassing for both guys. You had to really work with Steiner and allow him to get his power shots and make it a slow enough match that doesn't make Steiner look like a fish out of water.
    Some say Scott Steiner was only a half-decent babyface when he was with the Steiner Brothers (ie: tag teaming with Rick from 1988 to '97-'98) because Rick was at least able to play a convincing face, not because Scott had the amazing in-ring talent. Plus, Rick was the glue that kept Scott together. Some say once the Steiner Bros. split up in 1998 as the bigger star Scott grew to become, the bigger his massive ego grew out of control based on thinking he doesn't need to sell his opponents' moves or put others over in WCW from '98-'99 through '00-'01 because he just began his singles career after years of tag teaming with Rick.

    Steiner's massive ego led to his arrest for running over a construction worker in 1998, along with punching out an EMT in 2001. Strange enough that Scott only started racking up arrests of legal entanglement issues when he was Big Poppa Pump, whereas he previously had zero arrests to his record while he was part of The Steiner Brothers. One example of why Scott Steiner's Big Poppa Pump character can often blur the lines of kayfabe and reality, the arrests. Buff Bagwell even brought up Scott's 1998 arrest on TV once in 1999. And we all know Scott was just detained when airport officials misunderstood him when he told Jennifer Hogan that Hulk Hogan inducting Randy Savage was asinine, which is pretty understandable since Hogan and Savage had a real-life feud. Hogan was the only logical choice to induct Savage to the 2015 WWE Hall of Fame, unless Ricky Steamboat was another option to induct Savage. No way it's DDP inducting Savage since Savage had very little history with DDP besides his last epic blood feud with him for much of 1997. DDP went on to become a star while Savage's career petered out after joining the nWo.

    Scott's in-ring talent and freakish athleticism were factors in being able to prove that he can be a babyface. He's just much more preferred as a heel since he has the mean and abrasive personality, both in real-life and in kayfabe, ingrained into his Big Poppa Pump character. Getting people riled up is what a heel's job is supposed to do, and that's why after he turned heel at SuperBrawl VIII (8) in February 23, 1998; Scott stopped pulling Frankensteiners in favor of a less-risky wrestling style where he just uses power shots and low-blow groin attacks to protect himself from getting injured even worse down the road. Scott became the entertaining character he needed to be.

    As for his failed WWE run, at least he lasted longer than both Scott Hall, Curt Hennig and Buff Bagwell, who were all quickly canned the moment WWF acquired them. Steiner lasted from November 2002 through January 2004, and technically he was a member of WWE through August 17, 2004. Steiner was an inactive healthy scratch for much of 2004 up until WWE finally pulled the plug on Scott Steiner's injury-plagued WWE run because WWE knew Steiner's body couldn't handle the rigors of wrestling anymore after years of taking enough physical punishment since he begun his pro wrestling career in 1986. As for the rest of the time he was active in WWE after Triple H, Scott Steiner was placed in Raw's tag team division where he teamed up with Test managed by Stacy Keibler, which has to be a step down for Scott since he's at his best with Midajah in 2000-01 WCW. Raw had no interest in building the WWE World Tag Team Championship title picture beyond the reigning champs and the top challengers, so Scott Steiner and Test never got a Tag Title run.

    I'm also guessing Scott Steiner's failed 2000s WWE run had to do with Vince McMahon getting back at him for the way he left the WWF in 1994 when Vince offered Scott to go singles as a heel and break up The Steiner Brothers, but Scott refused to split up with Rick since Scott going singles would've meant Rick spends the rest of his career toiling in midcard obscurity. That led to a shouting match with Vince McMahon, and Scott seemed miserable working the WWF style in his original WWF run from 1992-1994. Add on his later WCW years where he got an increasingly bad reputation since he became Big Poppa Pump, plus hating on Ric Flair for Flair sandbagging him in his 1991 Clash of the Champions main event match to the point that Scott cut an unauthorized shoot promo in 2000 on Flair. DDP was also on the receiving end of a Scott Steiner shoot promo, as well as Kimberly.

    Flair may hate DDP since Flair wouldn't step away from the limelight, but Flair wasn't back in the WWF when Vince brought DDP in. Flair never re-debuted for the WWF until late 2001, so Vince likely wanted to give DDP the legends treatment no matter what Flair protests of a possible DDP main event run in the WWF. If only DDP was healthy enough for a full WWF run, maybe Vince wouldn't feel the need to bury him. DDP would've had a successful WWF run if he was healthy enough throughout, whereas Scott Steiner was notoriously known for not getting along with management, whether it's Bill Watts, Vince McMahon, Ric Flair, Triple H, Stephanie McMahon or Paul Heyman. That's why The Steiner Brothers spent much of 1995 in journeymen territory since neither Rick nor Scott were working for WWF or WCW, with a small run in ECW.
    Last edited by FilipoSooa; 04-30-2017 at 11:03 AM.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by Blindy View Post
    2) Injuries he compounded from the wear and tear in Japan, and WCW led to a immobile Steiner at the time he signed with the WWE. The feud with Test was embarrassing for both guys. You had to really work with Steiner and allow him to get his power shots and make it a slow enough match that doesn't make Steiner look like a fish out of water.
    I think all the political stuff aside, this is true. I think even Triple H would be happy to do business and pull a few decent matches out of anyone, whether he's going to bury them or not. Steiner just wasn't that great in the ring, in fact he wasn't even good. Injury, age, immobility. He was a joke.

    I've always felt, the WCW guys, were never on the same level as the WWF guys at the time. And it's pretty clear the WWF and Vince McMahon felt the same way.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    I don't think there is any vast conspiracy at work here. Bombing against HHH on PPV in his very first match is what killed Steiner. There was no recovering from that. It's a legit contender for worst championship match in WWE history. Had Steiner had six months of even tolerable in ring showings under his belt maybe it could have been excused as simply an off night, but he didn't. He laid an egg in his very first showing and it killed him.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Did the BPP version of Scotty ever prodouce a decent "workratey" match?
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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by PI View Post
    Did the BPP version of Scotty ever prodouce a decent "workratey" match?
    He had a highly regarded match with Goldberg near the end of WCW that I've never seen.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by Baker View Post
    I don't think there is any vast conspiracy at work here. Bombing against HHH on PPV in his very first match is what killed Steiner. There was no recovering from that. It's a legit contender for worst championship match in WWE history. Had Steiner had six months of even tolerable in ring showings under his belt maybe it could have been excused as simply an off night, but he didn't. He laid an egg in his very first showing and it killed him.
    Critics of Scott Steiner say that Scott Steiner took too much time off after WCW was bought out from WWF only being concerned with how good he looks in terms of being musclebound and years of excessive body training (ie: pumping iron), plus his backstage reputation played a big factor in WWF/E delaying Steiner's debut too long. Vince and WWF tried Scott Hall, Curt Hennig and Buff Bagwell first and hoped that those three wouldn't be major backstage problematics, to show Steiner that his backstage antics (like Hall's, Hennig's and Bagwell's) wouldn't be tolerated in WWF. The chances Vince took on Hall, Hennig and Bagwell were all proven to be worthless gambles.

    Such a night and day comparison regarding the Scott Steiner from the final episode of WCW Nitro where he lost the WCW World Heavyweight Championship Belt to Booker T versus the Scott Steiner from the abysmal Royal Rumble 2003 outing versus Triple H where BPP failed to take advantage of his two main event chances for the WWE World Heavyweight Championship Belt on RAW's main event picture. His abysmal outings in Royal Rumble 2003 and No Way Out 2003 indicated that Scott Steiner was going to be benched for WrestleMania X9 (19) in favor of Booker T. Fans thought Booker T could at least stand a better chance lasting longer in ring matches than Steiner did.

    Maybe Scott Steiner and WWE are just not a very good fit for each other. Anyway, Scott Steiner as Big Poppa Pump wasn't really work-ratey because ever since he made it to being a singles main event performer in 1998, he decided he had no desire to improve on his weaknesses, as well as declaring that he would quit selling his opponents' moves or put anyone over. That explains why Steiner grew a massive ego by the late 1990s, because he thinks there's nothing left for him to improve upon, and now he's made it as a main event performer. Maybe his critics declared him to have become lazy as an in-ring performer since becoming Big Poppa Pump, being limited to lifting weights and cutting promos.

    Vince was okay with Kevin Nash not chain wrestling, yet he expects Steiner to be the wrestler he used to be.
    Last edited by FilipoSooa; 05-01-2017 at 08:21 AM.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by FilipoSooa
    Critics of Scott Steiner say that Scott Steiner took too much time off after WCW was bought out from WWF only being concerned with how good he looks in terms of being musclebound and years of excessive body training (ie: pumping iron), plus his backstage reputation played a big factor in WWF/E delaying Steiner's debut too long. Vince and WWF tried Scott Hall, Curt Hennig and Buff Bagwell first and hoped that those three wouldn't be major backstage problematics, to show Steiner that his backstage antics (like Hall's, Hennig's and Bagwell's) wouldn't be tolerated in WWF. The chances Vince took on Hall, Hennig and Bagwell were all proven to be worthless gambles.

    Such a night and day comparison regarding the Scott Steiner from the final episode of WCW Nitro where he lost the WCW World Heavyweight Championship Belt to Booker T versus the Scott Steiner from the abysmal Royal Rumble 2003 outing versus Triple H where BPP failed to take advantage of his two main event chances for the WWE World Heavyweight Championship Belt on RAW's main event picture. His abysmal outings in Royal Rumble 2003 and No Way Out 2003 indicated that Scott Steiner was going to be benched for WrestleMania X9 (19) in favor of Booker T. Fans thought Booker T could at least stand a better chance lasting longer in ring matches than Steiner did.

    Maybe Scott Steiner and WWE are just not a very good fit for each other. Anyway, Scott Steiner as Big Poppa Pump wasn't really work-ratey because ever since he made it to being a singles main event performer in 1998, he decided he had no desire to improve on his weaknesses, as well as declaring that he would quit selling his opponents' moves or put anyone over. That explains why Steiner grew a massive ego by the late 1990s, because he thinks there's nothing left for him to improve upon, and now he's made it as a main event performer. Maybe his critics declared him to have become lazy as an in-ring performer since becoming Big Poppa Pump, being limited to lifting weights and cutting promos.

    Vince was okay with Kevin Nash not chain wrestling, yet he expects Steiner to be the wrestler he used to be.
    Unrealistic expectation indeed but I don't recall Nash ever chain wrestling.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Interesting take on the feud from kevin kelly

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by Baker View Post
    I don't think there is any vast conspiracy at work here. Bombing against HHH on PPV in his very first match is what killed Steiner. There was no recovering from that. It's a legit contender for worst championship match in WWE history. Had Steiner had six months of even tolerable in ring showings under his belt maybe it could have been excused as simply an off night, but he didn't. He laid an egg in his very first showing and it killed him.
    I was going to say something similar to this. The feud and matches he had with Triple H was awful and it was downhill from there. Does anyone remember when they were doing push up contests and arm wrestling? I always thought it was because they were trying to hide the fact that Steiner couldn't wrestle well anymore and then I wondered why they were even using him. I remember him eventually being in a tag team with Test and him not really doing much after this.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    I have now come to the realization that in order for Scott Steiner to be a useful key piece, I think he needs a wrestling company that has a strong veteran presence in the locker room to handle him. People like Rick Steiner and Jeff Jarrett, who are the only ones who know how to handle him and tolerate his backstage antics. Normally wrestling companies like WCW and now WWE get flak for bringing on older established veterans, but Steiner's an exception to the rule. WWE built around a combination of select veterans and certain younger stars like Triple H, Brock Lesnar, Kurt Angle and later John Cena, Randy Orton and Batista, so there's a fair chance the only veterans in WWE at the moment were HHH, HBK and Flair, all of whom despise Steiner.

    Steiner simply needed a wrestling company and a locker room full of veterans who accept him for who he is, like Vince Russo, Kevin Nash, Scott Hall, Rick Steiner, Buff Bagwell and Jeff Jarrett. All these guys (except for Russo) were there for the grand opening of Scott Steiner's Shoney's Restaurant in the same stomping grounds where JCP/NWA/WCW used to exist. Put Steiner in the same locker room as Shawn Michaels, Triple H and Ric Flair; and none of these three know how to handle him nor do they care about him, and you have a potential locker room disaster because Vince simply doesn't like guys like Scott Steiner, guys who truly stand up for what they believe in, speak their own minds, and if he sees some shady stuff that he saw with Bill Watts, Flair, HHH, Stephanie, HBK, Vince and later Hogan and Bischoff, he'll hold them accountable. He's not two-faced like Hogan, Flair and Hunter, he's a straight-shooter like Scott Hall, except Hall has the benefit of working with people in higher places like The Kliq, Vince McMahon and Eric Bischoff, whereas Steiner doesn't have the same benefit of having friends in higher places, burned bridges everywhere he went whether it's WCW, WWF, Japan, ECW and TNA; and I guess Vince doesn't have an issue with Hall speaking his own mind compared to Vince taking an issue with Steiner's way of words and sees it as Steiner rubbing him and HHH the wrong way.
    Last edited by FilipoSooa; 05-05-2017 at 08:53 AM.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by nath45 View Post
    I think all the political stuff aside, this is true. I think even Triple H would be happy to do business and pull a few decent matches out of anyone, whether he's going to bury them or not. Steiner just wasn't that great in the ring, in fact he wasn't even good. Injury, age, immobility. He was a joke.

    I've always felt, the WCW guys, were never on the same level as the WWF guys at the time. And it's pretty clear the WWF and Vince McMahon felt the same way.
    If they were looking for guys in WCW to keep up with his guys then you need to look way beyond most of the WCW main event guys. WCW shows always consisted of cruiserweights as warm up acts and younger more athletic guys in the mid-card. The main venters were the slower former WWF guys who weren't going to put in any effort in the ring because they learned from Vince that all those fancy schmancy moves don't sell tickets. Its great to own the territory with the largest markets in the USA, then you can throw crap at them and they will eat it up. The WWF got in trouble and had to resort to ripping off stories/characters from a "sort-of" national company in ECW to defeat the other national company in WCW.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by FilipoSooa View Post
    I have now come to the realization that in order for Scott Steiner to be a useful key piece, I think he needs a wrestling company that has a strong veteran presence in the locker room to handle him. People like Rick Steiner and Jeff Jarrett, who are the only ones who know how to handle him and tolerate his backstage antics. Normally wrestling companies like WCW and now WWE get flak for bringing on older established veterans, but Steiner's an exception to the rule. WWE built around a combination of select veterans and certain younger stars like Triple H, Brock Lesnar, Kurt Angle and later John Cena, Randy Orton and Batista, so there's a fair chance the only veterans in WWE at the moment were HHH, HBK and Flair, all of whom despise Steiner.

    Steiner simply needed a wrestling company and a locker room full of veterans who accept him for who he is, like Vince Russo, Kevin Nash, Scott Hall, Rick Steiner, Buff Bagwell and Jeff Jarrett. All these guys (except for Russo) were there for the grand opening of Scott Steiner's Shoney's Restaurant in the same stomping grounds where JCP/NWA/WCW used to exist. Put Steiner in the same locker room as Shawn Michaels, Triple H and Ric Flair; and none of these three know how to handle him nor do they care about him, and you have a potential locker room disaster because Vince simply doesn't like guys like Scott Steiner, guys who truly stand up for what they believe in, speak their own minds, and if he sees some shady stuff that he saw with Bill Watts, Flair, HHH, Stephanie, HBK, Vince and later Hogan and Bischoff, he'll hold them accountable. He's not two-faced like Hogan, Flair and Hunter, he's a straight-shooter like Scott Hall, except Hall has the benefit of working with people in higher places like The Kliq, Vince McMahon and Eric Bischoff, whereas Steiner doesn't have the same benefit of having friends in higher places, burned bridges everywhere he went whether it's WCW, WWF, Japan, ECW and TNA; and I guess Vince doesn't have an issue with Hall speaking his own mind compared to Vince taking an issue with Steiner's way of words and sees it as Steiner rubbing him and HHH the wrong way.

    I think you nailed it. Steiner certainly is a guy who speaks his mind. When he sees crap, he calls crap. However, while I have never personally witnessed a backstage Steiner blowup, I can imagine its pretty bad. He just can't do that in a modern publicly traded corporation like the WWE as it could result in lawsuits because their are people working backstage that don't have pro wrestling in their bloodlines. For these folks its just a job and they won't just look the other way when Steiner calls them something racist, anti semantic or whatever because they are afraid of being blackballed.

    The one thing overlooked is all the crappy main events Triple H was involved in around this period. Take a look back at some of the Wrestlemania main events and you see a burned out crowd looking at a Triple H who is doing nothing to get them back into the show. His matches vs. Booker T and Batista at mania were really bad. I can't blame the fans for their reaction to the Bokker T match as Angle/Lesnar closed the show to much more alive stadium. What I'm trying to say is that HHH doesn't have the in-ring skills to turn a crowd around.
    Last edited by bischoffs brain; 05-07-2017 at 12:58 PM.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain
    If they were looking for guys in WCW to keep up with his guys then you need to look way beyond most of the WCW main event guys. WCW shows always consisted of cruiserweights as warm up acts and younger more athletic guys in the mid-card. The main venters were the slower former WWF guys who weren't going to put in any effort in the ring because they learned from Vince that all those fancy schmancy moves don't sell tickets. Its great to own the territory with the largest markets in the USA, then you can throw crap at them and they will eat it up. The WWF got in trouble and had to resort to ripping off stories/characters from a "sort-of" national company in ECW to defeat the other national company in WCW.
    Good point! Come to think I think the cruiserweights fared best out of the WCW guys who came over after the WCW and ECW purchases.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain View Post
    I think you nailed it. Steiner certainly is a guy who speaks his mind. When he sees crap, he calls crap. However, while I have never personally witnessed a backstage Steiner blowup, I can imagine its pretty bad. He just can't do that in a modern publicly traded corporation like the WWE as it could result in lawsuits because their are people working backstage that don't have pro wrestling in their bloodlines. For these folks its just a job and they won't just look the other way when Steiner calls them something racist, anti semantic or whatever because they are afraid of being blackballed.

    The one thing overlooked is all the crappy main events Triple H was involved in around this period. Take a look back at some of the WrestleMania main events and you see a burned out crowd looking at a Triple H who is doing nothing to get them back into the show. His matches vs. Booker T and Batista at Mania were really bad. I can't blame the fans for their reaction to the Booker T match as Kurt Angle/Brock Lesnar closed the show to a much more alive stadium. What I'm trying to say is that HHH doesn't have the in-ring skills to turn a crowd around.
    His backstage blowups were cited as a major reason why Vince was super hesitant to bring him back to the WWF/E when WCW closed up shop in 2001 for the InVasion angle. Sure, Steiner may have had a history of backstage blowups even when he was younger, yet they happened in small doses. It wasn't until Scott Steiner transformed from the other half of the Steiner Brothers into Big Poppa Pump that Steiner's backstage attitude really changed for the worse when he did an unauthorized shoot promo on Flair, supposedly sexually harassed Kimberly and engaged in fighting and violence with Diamond Dallas Page.

    Maybe in Vince McMahon's eyes in regards to certain WCW guys who have had far worse backstage reputations than Hogan and Nash; I think Vince sees Hall, Hennig, Luger, Bret and Savage and even Buff Bagwell as more redeemable than Steiner. Bret eventually made peace with the WWE after his stroke even though it took his 2002 stroke to set a chain of events to Bret's eventual return. Savage was last seen in the WWF in 1994 but eventually had signed an action figure deal in 2010. Hennig may have gotten fired over the Brock Lesnar incident under the infamous 2002 Plane Ride From Hell saga but Vince (no stranger to doing angles based on real-life events) would have gladly welcomed Hennig back to the WWF in late 2002 once the real fallout died down. Hall continued having legal entanglement problems with alcoholism before he joined DDP Yoga to make a successful recovery with Jake Roberts. Luger had legal entanglement issues over Miss Elizabeth's death in 2003 then years later had a spinal stroke (2007) in the airplane that changed him from an arrogant snob to a humble genuine Born Again Christian before being back in WWE in 2011 to oversee their Wellness Policy. Bagwell (like Steiner) may have had backstage blowups on his own, but his problems were the instigator-type variety than outright fighting and violence like Steiner.

    Now, I can safely say Scott Hall is a straight shooter too and he had alcoholism, yet Hall at least managed to avoid acting like an undisciplined non-conformist backstage brawler. Most wrestling fans have plenty of empathy for Hall since he was so beloved that his fans were even willing to raise money to help Hall pay for his hip surgeries several years ago. Hall's wrestling career may have been hindered by his alcoholism but remained a pleasant person backstage. But when Steiner's glaring personal issues became an issue in the wake of the Hogan fiasco in 2015, very few fans have little to no sympathy for Steiner. I can buy alcoholism as a reason for Hall being unable to progress to the main events like he should've had, but not for Steiner being a selfish backstage bully at every single one of his stops. Steiner might have been a cancerous selfish jerk who may possibly have had serious drug dependency problems, but smarks will still see Steiner as a cancerous selfish jerk regardless. Substance abuse issues don't really affect your moral citizen character unless being a backstage bully who acts like a big shot main eventer because he wants to be a World Champion without playing backstage politics qualifies as an issue that could affect your moral citizen character.

    Some people see Steiner as a selfish serial loser who had all the talent to be a consistent overall wrestler/entertainer with his marvelous wrestling skills from '89-'94 and his epic mic skills from '98-'01 but only showed both in glimpses like the 2000 Fall Brawl PPV match with Goldberg. They also see Steiner as a lazy, selfish, undisciplined bully (on-screen, off-screen, backstage and away from the ring) and a lousy co-worker, and a nonsensical backstage brawl and a severe lawsuit waiting to happen. When he wanted to, Steiner could be great, but that was about 10% of his career. Being a legit backstage tough guy can be an asset as we've seen in the cases of Rick Rude, Vader, Paul Orndorff, Meng, Ron Simmons, Scott Norton, Kevin Nash, Ken Shamrock, Booker T, Stevie Ray, Steve Blackman, etc. but in Steiner's case, it led to an overall wrestling career best remembered for undisciplined backstage brawls. Steiner's skill sets may have been enough to give him the potential/upside to be mentioned with guys like Billy Graham, Bruno Sammartino, Andre The Giant, Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Randy Savage, Ultimate Warrior, Sting, Goldberg, Kevin Nash, Steve Austin, The Rock, John Cena, Batista, Randy Orton and Brock Lesnar, but he either didn't put them all together or applied them so sparingly. Add the locker room issues, and most companies would undoubtedly feel they're better off without him.

    In the grand scheme of things, Steiner was the kind of wrestler who had everything you'd want to be a peak Randy Orton or '93 Bret Hart or rich man's Scott Norton or poor man's '00 Triple H, except Steiner had none of the consistency or maturity. There was no doubt in my mind watching the NWA for Sting, Steiner and Luger, you would have thought Steiner was going to be the better apparent heir to Flair should Flair have retired at 40? Steiner should have won World Championship belts while wrestling 30-60 minute matches a year.

    I think in his later years, it came out that Steiner wasn't psychologically well (I've seen some recent YouTube comments and replies stating that Steiner either has autism or Aspergers) when he was wrestling. I don't know the whole story behind his history, but i remember hearing things.

    But from afar, my suspicion with Steiner was always that certain kinds of wrestlers are brought up to be a certain way, from the day they are natural born wrestlers with pro wrestling in their bloodlines and into the main wrestling companies such as WCW and WWF. You want that dude to wrestle harder than anyone, set the tone for his fellow peers, and you want him to be a mean mean dude in the ring. You want him to spit blood and teeth into a bucket backstage and you want being booked to lose to make him literally puke after matches. But the fine line there is all that intensity and emotional energy and adrenaline the old school trainers have been pumping into these guys, some of them can't turn it off when they leave the ring and the arena. And for some of them, it also makes them do stupid stuff in the ring and away from the arena. Steiner was one of those guys, i think, where all of his whole adrenaline ended up going to a bad place.

    I'm sorry I've had to call it a disappointing wrestling career, and that's coming from a Scott Steiner fan like myself. I still have respect for his unique entertaining ways on the mic whether it's unscripted shoot promos in WCW's final years (especially during the peak years of the Big Poppa Pump era and his BPP singles character) or his shoot interviews where he's more candid. I just simply think Steiner might've been consumed by the wrestling business because dirt sheet reports had him pegged to be the Next Bruno Sammartino, that caused most of his problems. I simply have no explanation for Scott Steiner's wrestling career.
    Last edited by FilipoSooa; 05-07-2017 at 03:55 PM.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by FilipoSooa View Post
    His backstage blowups were cited as a major reason why Vince was super hesitant to bring him back to the WWF/E when WCW closed up shop in 2001 for the InVasion angle. Sure, Steiner may have had a history of backstage blowups even when he was younger, yet they happened in small doses. It wasn't until Scott Steiner transformed from the other half of the Steiner Brothers into Big Poppa Pump that Steiner's backstage attitude really changed for the worse when he did an unauthorized shoot promo on Flair, supposedly sexually harassed Kimberly and engaged in fighting and violence with Diamond Dallas Page.

    Maybe in Vince McMahon's eyes in regards to certain WCW guys who have had far worse backstage reputations than Hogan and Nash; I think Vince sees Hall, Hennig, Luger, Bret and Savage and even Buff Bagwell as more redeemable than Steiner. Bret eventually made peace with the WWE after his stroke even though it took his 2002 stroke to set a chain of events to Bret's eventual return. Savage was last seen in the WWF in 1994 but eventually had signed an action figure deal in 2010. Hennig may have gotten fired over the Brock Lesnar incident under the infamous 2002 Plane Ride From Hell saga but Vince (no stranger to doing angles based on real-life events) would have gladly welcomed Hennig back to the WWF in late 2002 once the real fallout died down. Hall continued having legal entanglement problems with alcoholism before he joined DDP Yoga to make a successful recovery with Jake Roberts. Luger had legal entanglement issues over Miss Elizabeth's death in 2003 then years later had a spinal stroke (2007) in the airplane that changed him from an arrogant snob to a humble genuine Born Again Christian before being back in WWE in 2011 to oversee their Wellness Policy. Bagwell (like Steiner) may have had backstage blowups on his own, but his problems were the instigator-type variety than outright fighting and violence like Steiner.

    Now, I can safely say Scott Hall is a straight shooter too and he had alcoholism, yet Hall at least managed to avoid acting like an undisciplined non-conformist backstage brawler. Most wrestling fans have plenty of empathy for Hall since he was so beloved that his fans were even willing to raise money to help Hall pay for his hip surgeries several years ago. Hall's wrestling career may have been hindered by his alcoholism but remained a pleasant person backstage. But when Steiner's glaring personal issues became an issue in the wake of the Hogan fiasco in 2015, very few fans have little to no sympathy for Steiner. I can buy alcoholism as a reason for Hall being unable to progress to the main events like he should've had, but not for Steiner being a selfish backstage bully at every single one of his stops. Steiner might have been a cancerous selfish jerk who may possibly have had serious drug dependency problems, but smarks will still see Steiner as a cancerous selfish jerk regardless. Substance abuse issues don't really affect your moral citizen character unless being a backstage bully who acts like a big shot main eventer because he wants to be a World Champion without playing backstage politics qualifies as an issue that could affect your moral citizen character.

    Some people see Steiner as a selfish serial loser who had all the talent to be a consistent overall wrestler/entertainer with his marvelous wrestling skills from '89-'94 and his epic mic skills from '98-'01 but only showed both in glimpses like the 2000 Fall Brawl PPV match with Goldberg. They also see Steiner as a lazy, selfish, undisciplined bully (on-screen, off-screen, backstage and away from the ring) and a lousy co-worker, and a nonsensical backstage brawl and a severe lawsuit waiting to happen. When he wanted to, Steiner could be great, but that was about 10% of his career. Being a legit backstage tough guy can be an asset as we've seen in the cases of Rick Rude, Vader, Paul Orndorff, Meng, Ron Simmons, Scott Norton, Kevin Nash, Ken Shamrock, Booker T, Stevie Ray, Steve Blackman, etc. but in Steiner's case, it led to an overall wrestling career best remembered for undisciplined backstage brawls. Steiner's skill sets may have been enough to give him the potential/upside to be mentioned with guys like Billy Graham, Bruno Sammartino, Andre The Giant, Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Randy Savage, Ultimate Warrior, Sting, Goldberg, Kevin Nash, Steve Austin, The Rock, John Cena, Batista, Randy Orton and Brock Lesnar, but he either didn't put them all together or applied them so sparingly. Add the locker room issues, and most companies would undoubtedly feel they're better off without him.

    In the grand scheme of things, Steiner was the kind of wrestler who had everything you'd want to be a peak Randy Orton or '93 Bret Hart or rich man's Scott Norton or poor man's '00 Triple H, except Steiner had none of the consistency or maturity. There was no doubt in my mind watching the NWA for Sting, Steiner and Luger, you would have thought Steiner was going to be the better apparent heir to Flair should Flair have retired at 40? Steiner should have won World Championship belts while wrestling 30-60 minute matches a year.

    I think in his later years, it came out that Steiner wasn't psychologically well (I've seen some recent YouTube comments and replies stating that Steiner either has autism or Aspergers) when he was wrestling. I don't know the whole story behind his history, but i remember hearing things.

    But from afar, my suspicion with Steiner was always that certain kinds of wrestlers are brought up to be a certain way, from the day they are natural born wrestlers with pro wrestling in their bloodlines and into the main wrestling companies such as WCW and WWF. You want that dude to wrestle harder than anyone, set the tone for his fellow peers, and you want him to be a mean mean dude in the ring. You want him to spit blood and teeth into a bucket backstage and you want being booked to lose to make him literally puke after matches. But the fine line there is all that intensity and emotional energy and adrenaline the old school trainers have been pumping into these guys, some of them can't turn it off when they leave the ring and the arena. And for some of them, it also makes them do stupid stuff in the ring and away from the arena. Steiner was one of those guys, i think, where all of his whole adrenaline ended up going to a bad place.

    I'm sorry I've had to call it a disappointing wrestling career, and that's coming from a Scott Steiner fan like myself. I still have respect for his unique entertaining ways on the mic whether it's unscripted shoot promos in WCW's final years (especially during the peak years of the Big Poppa Pump era and his BPP singles character) or his shoot interviews where he's more candid. I just simply think Steiner might've been consumed by the wrestling business because dirt sheet reports had him pegged to be the Next Bruno Sammartino, that caused most of his problems. I simply have no explanation for Scott Steiner's wrestling career.

    I think when you take his volatile nature(perhaps aspergers but I doubt autism)and mix it in with the selfish personalities of people Hogan and Nash, add some drug dependency and you get a bad result. Usually the negative stuff I hear about him is from people who had a documented incident with him. Not a whole lot of bad things from anyone else which makes me suspect that it isn't always him ay fault.
    Also, I actually sided with him in the whole Steiner Vs. Dixie Carter/Hogan fiasco. Steiner sees a company started by his friend Jarrett being destroyed by Hogan and Bischoff. TNA files a silly lawsuit that somehow stopped Steiner from being able to talk about stuff that happened in TNA after he left the company. I don't how that was constitutional as the WWE has not pulled that one yet(waiting for Mauron Ranallo's contract to be officially done).
    Last edited by bischoffs brain; 05-08-2017 at 12:22 AM.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Scott Steiner is an overrated egotistical piece of shit...

    Only great at running his stupid idiot mouth...

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Considering Steiner's strengths as Big Poppa Pump at the time were as a heel, and considering his amateur background... would he have been better suited on SmackDown? They were turning Brock face around this time and were in need of fodder for him still.

    Whether or not you take the title off Brock because of his rib injury, does a little feud with BPP potentially work out better (than BPP playing a terrible face foil to HHH)? Brock doesn't have the HHH ego or immobility issues, so he can presumably be thrown around a bit better to help hide Steiner's in-ring weaknesses. Plus he's also a freak of nature, so he ought to be able to throw Steiner around whether Steiner can assist or not.

    I'm picturing a world where the fans turn Lesnar face after impressive physical feats at Survivor Series 2002, namely going over Big Show in a glorified squash that sees Lesnar hit an F5 and possibly even a shooting star press? Lesnar is left wondering who's next, and the debuting Big Poppa Pump decides to sign with SD! to prove that he's the biggest, baddest alpha male in wrestling (plus Stephanie promises him a title shot to help woo him).

    Let's say Steiner gets himself DQ'd by going all loose cannon on Lesnar in December at Armageddon or whatever the PPV was. He lost the match and didn't win the title, but he made a statement by making Lesnar kinda look like his prison bitch. Steph says Steiner blew it though and won't give in to his demands of a rematch or simply awarding him the title. If Steiner wants another title shot, he can enter the Rumble. Let's say a vengeful Lesnar is somehow involved in Steiner's elimination from the Rumble, which sets up Lesnar/Steiner II at No Way Out, where Lesnar finally ragdolls Steiner and puts him away in 10 minutes or less.

    In typical heel fashion, Steiner can tuck his tail between his legs and jump to WCW 2.0 RAW and start the process of being shunted down the card as fodder for the rising Booker T and debuting Goldberg.



    Also... What is a drop foot injury?

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    Quote Originally Posted by PI
    Considering Steiner's strengths as Big Poppa Pump at the time were as a heel, and considering his amateur background... would he have been better suited on SmackDown? They were turning Brock face around this time and were in need of fodder for him still.

    Whether or not you take the title off Brock because of his rib injury, does a little feud with BPP potentially work out better (than BPP playing a terrible face foil to HHH)? Brock doesn't have the HHH ego or immobility issues, so he can presumably be thrown around a bit better to help hide Steiner's in-ring weaknesses. Plus he's also a freak of nature, so he ought to be able to throw Steiner around whether Steiner can assist or not.

    I'm picturing a world where the fans turn Lesnar face after impressive physical feats at Survivor Series 2002, namely going over Big Show in a glorified squash that sees Lesnar hit an F5 and possibly even a shooting star press? Lesnar is left wondering who's next, and the debuting Big Poppa Pump decides to sign with SD! to prove that he's the biggest, baddest alpha male in wrestling (plus Stephanie promises him a title shot to help woo him).

    Let's say Steiner gets himself DQ'd by going all loose cannon on Lesnar in December at Armageddon or whatever the PPV was. He lost the match and didn't win the title, but he made a statement by making Lesnar kinda look like his prison bitch. Steph says Steiner blew it though and won't give in to his demands of a rematch or simply awarding him the title. If Steiner wants another title shot, he can enter the Rumble. Let's say a vengeful Lesnar is somehow involved in Steiner's elimination from the Rumble, which sets up Lesnar/Steiner II at No Way Out, where Lesnar finally ragdolls Steiner and puts him away in 10 minutes or less.

    In typical heel fashion, Steiner can tuck his tail between his legs and jump to WCW 2.0 RAW and start the process of being shunted down the card as fodder for the rising Booker T and debuting Goldberg.



    Also... What is a drop foot injury?
    It's a nerve injury that affects a person's ability to lift their foot at the ankle. But your scenario is cool. It would've been something different.

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    Default Re: What went wrong with Scott Steiner's WWE run from 2002-2004?

    I met Shane Douglas at a show a few years ago, and I got to chat with him briefly. Buff Bagwell was also at this show. I asked Shane Douglas if there was any big name wrestlers that he gets to work with regularly, and he said it varies, but he joked with me about how if he was Scott Steiner, he wouldn't be talking to me for anything less than $100. Shane Douglas came off as a super cool guy. It was just funny that he was "joking" about Scott Steiner being a prick basically.

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