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Thread: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

  1. #26
    I feel kinda invincible Kilgore's Avatar

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain View Post
    The thing is if I ranked Bret based on what he meant to the WWE at the time then he would be above everyone from the tail end of the Attitude era until now. The company has 5 times more product on TV and way more ppv's. They can't rely on just one company ace at the top especially since you have 2 different brands and at one time had 3 brands(Raw, Smackdown, ECW). Alberto was never the company ace, but then who was? The company ace position has remained unfilled since HHH was boring fans to tears at the start of RAW every week.
    ADR does well in Mexico, Bret does well in Canada, yes. Nobody gives a shit about ADR in America or Europe, though. Bret was huge in Europe, and an okay draw in America. You're comparing an ace to what a fifth or sixth banana? It's a ridiculous comparison.

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain View Post
    Bret's drawing power as champ has always been a bit of a controversial issue.
    What is not controversial was he was a better draw than Alberto Del Rio.

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain View Post
    IMO, both Del Rio and Hart were/are exceptional talents in the ring. Both men came from a long lineage of wrestlers which means they understand the business. I factored in the fact that Bret was number one in the PWI top 500 for 2 years. However, Del Rio had a number 6,8 and 9 finish in 2011-2013. Being number 6 in 2011 is really about the same as being number 1 in 1993, IMO.
    The Miz was #1. Kane was #4. Mr. Anderson was #7. I don't even know who that is. What a murder's row.

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain View Post
    If you look at the PW lists, in 1992-1995 the top ten is pretty much the same guys in different order with a couple of guys out of right field in there(Lawler in 1992 for example). In 2011-now you have a much more volatile list.
    Volatility would make it easier to sneak into high placement. A more consistent list would make it harder.

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain View Post
    One other factor is that Del Rio has done much better outside of WWE than Bret Hart did outside the WWF. Much like free agents of the New England Patriots, when you don't perform outside your comfort zone then you could be labeled a "system" player/wrestler.
    Bret left the WWF at 40-years-old. Was forced to retire at 42. WWF had a monopoly by the time he was 43. Outside a better 1998 in WCW, there isn't really a scenario where Bret has a lot of success after Montreal. He was old, and soon the only game in town had recently ran him out of town and killed his brother, publicly.

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain View Post
    I do believe that Bret's status was elevated a little bit because of circumstances he had nothing to do with. The best thing to happen to Bret's career was the indictment of Vince McMahon on steroids.
    Anyway, if you put Del Rio in Bret's era and Bret into Del Rio's era, I believe that Del Rio comes out better but thats a fantasy booking thing.
    I would agree that Bret suffers greatly in this current era but Del Rio probably would have had like a year run in 1995 like everybody else before being released with no one caring. I can't picture a scenario where ADR succeeds during the New Generation. Vince even hiring him seems unlikely to me.


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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kilgore
    ADR does well in Mexico, Bret does well in Canada, yes. Nobody gives a shit about ADR in America or Europe, though. Bret was huge in Europe, and an okay draw in America. You're comparing an ace to what a fifth or sixth banana? It's a ridiculous comparison.


    What is not controversial was he was a better draw than Alberto Del Rio.


    The Miz was #1. Kane was #4. Mr. Anderson was #7. I don't even know who that is. What a murder's row.


    Volatility would make it easier to sneak into high placement. A more consistent list would make it harder.


    Bret left the WWF at 40-years-old. Was forced to retire at 42. WWF had a monopoly by the time he was 43. Outside a better 1998 in WCW, there isn't really a scenario where Bret has a lot of success after Montreal. He was old, and soon the only game in town had recently ran him out of town and killed his brother, publicly.


    I would agree that Bret suffers greatly in this current era but Del Rio probably would have had like a year run in 1995 like everybody else before being released with no one caring. I can't picture a scenario where ADR succeeds during the New Generation. Vince even hiring him seems unlikely to me.
    I think where Bret would be good money wise in this era would be merch sales. Going by reports this era isn't really much different than '95 since nobody was drawing exceptionally well domestically then and besides Cena nobody is really now either.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kilgore View Post
    ADR does well in Mexico, Bret does well in Canada, yes. Nobody gives a shit about ADR in America or Europe, though. Bret was huge in Europe, and an okay draw in America. You're comparing an ace to what a fifth or sixth banana? It's a ridiculous comparison.


    What is not controversial was he was a better draw than Alberto Del Rio.


    The Miz was #1. Kane was #4. Mr. Anderson was #7. I don't even know who that is. What a murder's row.


    Volatility would make it easier to sneak into high placement. A more consistent list would make it harder.


    Bret left the WWF at 40-years-old. Was forced to retire at 42. WWF had a monopoly by the time he was 43. Outside a better 1998 in WCW, there isn't really a scenario where Bret has a lot of success after Montreal. He was old, and soon the only game in town had recently ran him out of town and killed his brother, publicly.


    I would agree that Bret suffers greatly in this current era but Del Rio probably would have had like a year run in 1995 like everybody else before being released with no one caring. I can't picture a scenario where ADR succeeds during the New Generation. Vince even hiring him seems unlikely to me.
    Like I said, I'm only putting Bret in the neighborhood of Del Rio. As far as what happened to him with Owen and the bad WCW run;I feel bad for Bret because of the way his career ended in a match with Goldberg who I despise. However, I can't assume he would have done a bunch of fantastic things had it not been for Goldberg, Owen, the WCW sale etc.The fact that he came to WCW at the peak of its popularity and did nothing doesn't really help. It also doesn't help that while he was doing nothing in WCW, the company he left had an amazing resurgence without they guy who had been company ace during the bad years. I don't care why it happened if I am being as close to objective as possible. I've heard it stated a million times that Del Rio does better work outside the WWE in AAA, Lucha or possibly Impact. That doesn't mean i'm going to give Del Rio more points for his second WWE run because WWE mismanaged him after he beat Cena clean for the US title. BTW, if anyone asked me who I like better as a performer, I would say Bret.
    On the other hand, Del Rio isn't finished yet. Remember he basically walked into TNA and won the title on his first night. Sure they pulled a delayed Dusty finish, but that still counts for something. Also, he made EC3 tap out which Impact is trying to turn into a big deal. Also, as far as the PW list goes, while it may look bad now that The Miz was ranked #1, the fact was he had a great year that year. He held the title for a good amount of time and headlined a Wrestlemania. Yes, The Rock's involvement screwed that up, but he earned a top 5 finish at the least. Also, I think they ranked Mr. Anderson(how could you not know who that is)a bit high but that was the year he won Money in the Bank and PW gave him a lot of credit and maybe they assumed he would win the belt. Nobody saw Kennedy's future being so bleak as he was on a roll in the WWE for awhile, until he goes running off at the mouth about steroids. He did win the TNA belt during the Hogan administration a few times also. The he got lazy.
    Last edited by bischoffs brain; 04-29-2017 at 03:32 AM.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain View Post
    Ok, I guess you are talking about me with ranking Bret in the Alberto Del Rio range. Believe or not, I followed your criteria when ranking, especially the part about not allowing nostalgia to influence my ranking. Trust me, I'm not trying to be mean or disrespectful to Bret(as if Bret would give two shits about what i think) or any of his fans. The thing is if I ranked Bret based on what he meant to the WWE at the time then he would be above everyone from the tail end of the Attitude era until now. The company has 5 times more product on TV and way more ppv's. They can't rely on just one company ace at the top especially since you have 2 different brands and at one time had 3 brands(Raw, Smackdown, ECW). Alberto was never the company ace, but then who was? The company ace position has remained unfilled since HHH was boring fans to tears at the start of RAW every week.
    Bret's drawing power as champ has always been a bit of a controversial issue. He didn't do nearly as well in the USA as he did in Canada.The same could be said of Del Rio except gauging drawing power as champ is much harder to figure now. I know the company really liked Del Rio do to his ability to draw in Mexico. IMO, both Del Rio and Hart were/are exceptional talents in the ring. Both men came from a long lineage of wrestlers which means they understand the business. I factored in the fact that Bret was number one in the PWI top 500 for 2 years. However, Del Rio had a number 6,8 and 9 finish in 2011-2013. Being number 6 in 2011 is really about the same as being number 1 in 1993, IMO. If you look at the PW lists, in 1992-1995 the top ten is pretty much the same guys in different order with a couple of guys out of right field in there(Lawler in 1992 for example). In 2011-now you have a much more volatile list. One other factor is that Del Rio has done much better outside of WWE than Bret Hart did outside the WWF. Much like free agents of the New England Patriots, when you don't perform outside your comfort zone then you could be labeled a "system" player/wrestler. I do believe that Bret's status was elevated a little bit because of circumstances he had nothing to do with. The best thing to happen to Bret's career was the indictment of Vince McMahon on steroids.
    Anyway, if you put Del Rio in Bret's era and Bret into Del Rio's era, I believe that Del Rio comes out better but thats a fantasy booking thing. Like Austin and The Rock, Bret's time on the top was relatively short. However, Austin sold more merchandise than anyone once he reached the top after 7 pretty good years in the business. The Rock has had the best "short" career of any wrestler.
    Yeah I was actually referring to your mention of raking the two similarly. I understand your point and actually find Del Rio to be very talented in the ring and an underrated storyteller in and out of the ring. I don't think he got the longevity he deserved

    I respect your point as Bret Hart's case can be somewhat complex. He was a great wrestler, but many others since then have learned and expanded on that great wrestling. He was a great storyteller in the ring, but many others since then have learned and expanded on that great storytelling. He wasn't the greatest on the mic as a face (honestly many still struggle as a face on the mic which is why you see some faces gain a little edge to them. He was much better as a heel on the mic, but many others were better as a heel on the mic even if they were never all time great status.

    He, like many others, had more wrestling talent than the WWE system would allow sometimes and was pushed in the 5 moves of doom route. However even if he did 5 moves of doom like anyone else, he still offered a lot when the longer big matches took place. He didn't only use 5 moves in the Iron Man match with HBK, or the Summerslam match with Bulldog, or the Brother v Brother match at WMX, and so on. Austin had his. Cena has his. Triple did his. All of the greats had it. Even Daniel Bryan has his, but guys like Angle, Brian and Bret Hart are able to do much more throughout the match.

    I know, it's very subjective so I am simply saying I respect your opinion as I like Del Rio and find him underrated. However I believe Bret Hart deserves the respect many give him and a high ranking because not only did he benefit and become the top guy, but he carried it as well as he could and did just about everything on a very good, excellent and even great level which the circumstances given average mic work.

  5. #30
    Atodaso Strobe's Avatar

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    I'm struggling to see what a kayfabe magazine's lists have to do with anything.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strobe View Post
    I'm struggling to see what a kayfabe magazine's lists have to do with anything.
    Not that much. However, it serves as sort of a historical record to gauge what the people in the industry think of a talent. Its easy to say now that The Miz didn't deserve to be ranked number one but back then he was in the middle of a very good run. Nobody could predict that he would return to jobber to the stars status the very next year.

    About 5 years ago somebody on either this board or the one at wrestlecrap I believe, put together a very good top 100 of all time list. It was one of the best "list" pieces I had ever read. I was in agreement with exactly 99% of the ratings. there was one guy who I thought was way too low at around 85. That was Sting. I sent him a pm asking about it. In fact I used Bret Hart's placement at around 17 as an argument for Sting being higher on the list as I believe Sting is atleast an equal to Bret if not better. He gave me a solid argument and that was that. Sometimes, it just comes down to remembering your perspective when these guys were at the peak of their careers. If I made a list, I'm sure I would misplace put Bruno Sammartino because he was way before my time. Therefore, I might put too much/not enough stock into his record WWE title run that will never be broken.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain
    Not that much. However, it serves as sort of a historical record to gauge what the people in the industry think of a talent. Its easy to say now that The Miz didn't deserve to be ranked number one but back then he was in the middle of a very good run. Nobody could predict that he would return to jobber to the stars status the very next year.

    About 5 years ago somebody on either this board or the one at wrestlecrap I believe, put together a very good top 100 of all time list. It was one of the best "list" pieces I had ever read. I was in agreement with exactly 99% of the ratings. there was one guy who I thought was way too low at around 85. That was Sting. I sent him a pm asking about it. In fact I used Bret Hart's placement at around 17 as an argument for Sting being higher on the list as I believe Sting is atleast an equal to Bret if not better. He gave me a solid argument and that was that. Sometimes, it just comes down to remembering your perspective when these guys were at the peak of their careers. If I made a list, I'm sure I would misplace put Bruno Sammartino because he was way before my time. Therefore, I might put too much/not enough stock into his record WWE title run that will never be broken.
    Figured this was the reason. And how the rankings change yr to yr can be indicative of it.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain View Post
    Not that much. However, it serves as sort of a historical record to gauge what the people in the industry think of a talent. Its easy to say now that The Miz didn't deserve to be ranked number one but back then he was in the middle of a very good run. Nobody could predict that he would return to jobber to the stars status the very next year.

    About 5 years ago somebody on either this board or the one at wrestlecrap I believe, put together a very good top 100 of all time list. It was one of the best "list" pieces I had ever read. I was in agreement with exactly 99% of the ratings. there was one guy who I thought was way too low at around 85. That was Sting. I sent him a pm asking about it. In fact I used Bret Hart's placement at around 17 as an argument for Sting being higher on the list as I believe Sting is atleast an equal to Bret if not better. He gave me a solid argument and that was that. Sometimes, it just comes down to remembering your perspective when these guys were at the peak of their careers. If I made a list, I'm sure I would misplace put Bruno Sammartino because he was way before my time. Therefore, I might put too much/not enough stock into his record WWE title run that will never be broken.
    I'm dying to hear this.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Alberto Del Rio?!


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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by ShinobiMusashi
    Alberto Del Rio?!

    You posted the Shao Khan laugh!

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    On my own personal list he's a top 10 favorite of mine. Bret had this thing about him where he wasn't always the best promo guy but he made me believe in him in all the same through the story he could tell in the ring. I get he wasn't a top draw like a Hogan, Austin, or Rock but without Bret there is no way WWE would have made it through those dark financial years.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Kliq View Post
    I'm dying to hear this.
    I'm going to keep it short and on the major points. Well they were both in WCW at the same time and I would say that Sting fared better than Bret. From the time Bret came into WCW until the end Sting won the Championship 4 times while Bret sort of won twice. He one the belt then vacated it only to immediately win it back again in a "screw job" match. Yes, I know Bret had a lot of issues in this time period, but you can't really factor that into the equation. In the end Sting was a 9 time champion under the WCW/NWA banner. He was a 5 time champ under the TNA/NWA banner. So he has 14 title reigns total. Bret Hart had 5 WWF championships and 2 WCW championships for a total of 7 world championships. So Sting has twice the number as Bret. Of course you can over analyze these. You could say that the TNA championships shouldn't count for as much and my counter argument would be that the talent pool in TNA when Sting was champ was equal to or surpassing the WWF talent during Bret's time at the top. Don't confuse the WWF's revenues and TNA revenues for talent pool.

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    Senior Member vendrell's Avatar

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain View Post
    I'm going to keep it short and on the major points. Well they were both in WCW at the same time and I would say that Sting fared better than Bret. From the time Bret came into WCW until the end Sting won the Championship 4 times while Bret sort of won twice. He one the belt then vacated it only to immediately win it back again in a "screw job" match. Yes, I know Bret had a lot of issues in this time period, but you can't really factor that into the equation. In the end Sting was a 9 time champion under the WCW/NWA banner. He was a 5 time champ under the TNA/NWA banner. So he has 14 title reigns total. Bret Hart had 5 WWF championships and 2 WCW championships for a total of 7 world championships. So Sting has twice the number as Bret. Of course you can over analyze these. You could say that the TNA championships shouldn't count for as much and my counter argument would be that the talent pool in TNA when Sting was champ was equal to or surpassing the WWF talent during Bret's time at the top. Don't confuse the WWF's revenues and TNA revenues for talent pool.
    Just to point it out, Stings title runs were ridiculous in WCW with the crow gimmick. His big "win" over Hogan at starrcade was killed from the jump by having Hogan kick his ass the entire match, drop the big leg and beat him 1.2.3 clean only to have Bret come out and screw Hogan over and restart the match because of Nick Patricks "fast" count. So the title is taken from sting due to the controversy but wins it back anyways a month later getting another tainted win over Hogan. God Hogan was a dick. Anyways he loses it to Savage just a month or two later. Then he gets some fucking two hour title run on Nitro when he beat DDP. Then he beat hogan again and you guessed it, he didn't do it by being the better man, he had to have luger help him and turn "heel"...which to me Hogan deserved that shit anyways so to me Sting was the good guy in that scenario. Anyways he just loses it by getting it stripped away or some bull shit, I can't really recall why but it was WCW so it could have been for anything. I just remember fucking Hulk Hogan laying down in street clothes for Sting to pin him...the theme of Hogan never putting Sting over as an equal was something WCW really liked to hammer home at every opportunity. However Sting did hold 4 wins over Hogan in WCW so that is pretty generous by Hogan standards even if they were all tainted wins. With that said though, December 97 to the end, Sting clearly had a much better career than Bret did in WCW. Bret didn't want to be in WCW and it resonated on tv.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    To be fair, Sting was around longer than Bret as an active wrestler in WCW and post-WCW so of course he had more reigns. Plus, he was WCW's franchise guy for much longer.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by bischoffs brain View Post
    I'm going to keep it short and on the major points. Well they were both in WCW at the same time and I would say that Sting fared better than Bret. From the time Bret came into WCW until the end Sting won the Championship 4 times while Bret sort of won twice. He one the belt then vacated it only to immediately win it back again in a "screw job" match. Yes, I know Bret had a lot of issues in this time period, but you can't really factor that into the equation. In the end Sting was a 9 time champion under the WCW/NWA banner. He was a 5 time champ under the TNA/NWA banner. So he has 14 title reigns total. Bret Hart had 5 WWF championships and 2 WCW championships for a total of 7 world championships. So Sting has twice the number as Bret. Of course you can over analyze these. You could say that the TNA championships shouldn't count for as much and my counter argument would be that the talent pool in TNA when Sting was champ was equal to or surpassing the WWF talent during Bret's time at the top. Don't confuse the WWF's revenues and TNA revenues for talent pool.
    Why are you kayfabing me with these title reigns?

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Alberto Del Rio being Bret's equal is the wackiest theory I've seen on PW since Seth Rollins: Baddest Man on the Planet.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by Baker
    Alberto Del Rio being Bret's equal is the wackiest theory I've seen on PW since Seth Rollins: Baddest Man on the Planet.
    Noooooo! Somebody really said this?

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by vendrell View Post
    Just to point it out, Stings title runs were ridiculous in WCW with the crow gimmick. His big "win" over Hogan at starrcade was killed from the jump by having Hogan kick his ass the entire match, drop the big leg and beat him 1.2.3 clean only to have Bret come out and screw Hogan over and restart the match because of Nick Patricks "fast" count. So the title is taken from sting due to the controversy but wins it back anyways a month later getting another tainted win over Hogan. God Hogan was a dick. Anyways he loses it to Savage just a month or two later. Then he gets some fucking two hour title run on Nitro when he beat DDP. Then he beat hogan again and you guessed it, he didn't do it by being the better man, he had to have luger help him and turn "heel"...which to me Hogan deserved that shit anyways so to me Sting was the good guy in that scenario. Anyways he just loses it by getting it stripped away or some bull shit, I can't really recall why but it was WCW so it could have been for anything. I just remember fucking Hulk Hogan laying down in street clothes for Sting to pin him...the theme of Hogan never putting Sting over as an equal was something WCW really liked to hammer home at every opportunity. However Sting did hold 4 wins over Hogan in WCW so that is pretty generous by Hogan standards even if they were all tainted wins. With that said though, December 97 to the end, Sting clearly had a much better career than Bret did in WCW. Bret didn't want to be in WCW and it resonated on tv.
    Well of course, I mean if I sit there and go over the shenanigans involved in all those title then I'd be typing all day. A couple of Bret's aren't "legit" wins either but this is freaking pro-wrestling we are talking about. Sometimes you just have to compare what is tangible and that gives you a good starting point on where you rate a guy. In the WWE, so many guys start with a rocket push to the moon. They win the mid-card title whether its the US or Intercontinental belt. Then the company sees what they have and the majority of the guys remain mid-carders are repackaged etc. Like the New Day, Cesaro etc. Seamus did the same, but they decided he was worth having a run with the big belt. He did well enough to get another couple of runs and he has been demoted since his last title run with that League of Nations crap. Therefore, I would have to rank Sheamus a good number of spots above Cesaro even if I don't think he is a better talent. Where it gets even more confusing is where do you rank guys like Khali and Jack Swagger who have actually held a WWE world title. Thats why I'll never do a all time ranking list because its way too subjective and nobody is gonna pay me for it.

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    Senior Member RIH's Avatar

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    I would like to point out that, while I don't think Bret is THE best ever, I think he deserves all the respect in the world for three reasons:

    1. He became the top guy in the company after Hulk Hogan. It would have been difficult for ANYONE to follow Hogan's reign in the WWE during the 80's and early 90's but Bret was able to be successful despite having to follow Hogan as the top guy.

    2. The mid-90's is not exactly remembered as a great time for the WWE, but Bret was able to carry the company during this time. (1 and 2 kinda go together)

    3. Bret was also smaller than most of the former WWE Champions, and he paved the way for smaller guys who brought a technical wrestling style as opposed to being a huge powerhouse.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Overrated....

    Doesnt crack my top 25... He's not on this list...

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    My all time favourite wrestler. Of course back in the day I loved Hogan and then the Warrior but when I got older and discovered wrasslin' Bret's matches and even his promos from 96 were just great. The amount of wrestlers who say he's their favourite to work with speaks volumes. I still mark out when I watch his old matches and am going to watch some now.

    So I rank him number one, but I'm hardly a wrestling expert. Bret would cite Dynamite as the best.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Bret is a top ten by far. His matches with curt hennig put steamboat and flairs matches to shame. Bret also had great matches with Owen. His match with Owen at the Kuwait cup is just awesome. He also got great matches out of lazy workers such as Nash, Goldberg and Benoit. His 97 mic work is up there with the rock and Cena.



    Flair
    HHh
    Hart
    Angle
    Samartino
    Hennig
    Lesnar
    Orton
    Cena
    Taker

    Honorable mention Paul Roma

  23. #48
    Senior Member RIH's Avatar

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by spladle141 View Post
    Bret is a top ten by far. His matches with curt hennig put steamboat and flairs matches to shame. Bret also had great matches with Owen. His match with Owen at the Kuwait cup is just awesome. He also got great matches out of lazy workers such as Nash, Goldberg and Benoit. His 97 mic work is up there with the rock and Cena.



    Flair
    HHh
    Hart
    Angle
    Samartino
    Hennig
    Lesnar
    Orton
    Cena
    Taker

    Honorable mention Paul Roma

    So my question to YOU becomes: where do YOU rank Shawn?

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by RIH View Post
    So my question to YOU becomes: where do YOU rank Shawn?
    I would put hogan, savage and then him right below taker. He is great and all but his 195lb frame and constantly getting beat up in bars and by Marty Jeanety takes away his credibility. I am a huge fan of Punk too but he don't belong on a top 20 list.

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    Default Re: Where do YOU rank Bret Hart?

    Quote Originally Posted by spladle141 View Post
    Bret is a top ten by far. His matches with curt hennig put steamboat and flairs matches to shame. Bret also had great matches with Owen. His match with Owen at the Kuwait cup is just awesome. He also got great matches out of lazy workers such as Nash, Goldberg and Benoit. His 97 mic work is up there with the rock and Cena.



    Flair
    HHh
    Hart
    Angle
    Samartino
    Hennig
    Lesnar
    Orton
    Cena
    Taker

    Honorable mention Paul Roma

    I'm sure tons of people would take some issue with a top ten list that doesn't have Hogan in it. However, its your right. I personally can't stand Hogan, but I can't with good conscience keep him out the top ten. Sure, if I were to hold all his backstage backstabbing and politics against his ranking he would fall out the top 500. However, I don't think those things should be considered.

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