Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 53

Thread: The Matches Today Are Better

  1. #1
    Banned Justin Valuable's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Frisco, TX
    Age
    28
    Posts
    6,412

    Default The Matches Today Are Better

    Last night I had a lot of assignments to do for work so I decided to pop in some DVDs after Smackdown. A few days before I watched Orton/Cena from Summerslam 2009, Punk/Cena recently from RAW, as well as Orton/Christian from Smackdown. So last night I decided to watch some Ric Flair matches. I watched his epic battle with Ricky Steamboat from Wrestle War 1989. After that I watched those two again from their Spring Stampede Match in 1994.

    A few things stuck out to me:

    1. The matches from today's era are faster paced with more fluidity. While I enjoyed watching those two Flair/Steamboat matches it was obvious that the matches were slow paced, somewhat dragging on.

    2. The crowds are more emotionally involved in today's matches. The Flair/Steamboat match from 1994 was in Chicago (a vocal town always), but the crowd was dead for the whole match. The three matches I watched from today's era had the crowds completely into the match from bell to pinfall.

    3. Most important: the finishes in today's WWE are so much more convincing than the matches from years ago. Flair defeated Steamboat at WW 1989 with a lazy looking pinfall and in their 1994 match it ended with a controversial pin that came off flat, whereas the controversial pin from Cena/Punk from last year's match came off well. The finishes from the old days were very sloppy. One that comes to mind is when Flair defeated Race for the title at Starrcade.

    Most fans probably don't appreciate the match quality from today's WWE compared to years past. It seems like in any sport it's always hard to accept if something is possibly better now rather to then. Like a golf purist shooting down the idea of comparing Tiger Woods to Jack Nicklaus or a fan trying to argue that Lebron isn't in the same class as Michael Jordan -- fans like to cling on to the past while second guessing the present. For me I would much rather watch a 15-20 minute match than a 30 minute match that drags on to a sloppy finish.

  2. #2
    Moreoff than on Cereal Killer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Stuck inside my head
    Age
    39
    Posts
    3,836

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    I don't think you can base it on just Steamboat/Flair. If I had more time right now...I'd back it up, but that will have to wait until later. I'm also not saying one era is better than the other. I just think you can find matches that are equal in just about any era.

  3. #3
    Bosh! Coolstuff's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    England
    Age
    22
    Posts
    3,184

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    I can't wait to read some responses on this thread.

    I too watched the classic Flair/Steamboat from WrestleWar '89 earlier today and it is superb. The first point, yes matches are faster paced but that isn't necessarily a good thing. It's come to the point where a lot of the wrestlers now are moving at a million miles an hour and forgetting the basics like selling. I'd much rather watch a Flair/Steamboat match from the past then a Sin Cara/Justin Gabriel (just an example) match of today that moves a lot quicker.

    I'd definitely disagree with the second point. I believe as time has moved on, fans have become less vocal. I've been watching a lot of stuff from the 80's lately and the crowd were pretty much always into the matches, even if they sucked. The third point, yes the finishing sequences of wrestling nowadays is a lot better, but you could counter argument that with saying that now you pretty much know when the match is finished. Back then, a match could finish with pretty much any move. Which led to more unpredictable finishes.

    I'm not going to say this era is better than that or that era is better than this era. I enjoy both, but just some counter arguments for the points you have given.
    Thanks too Fresh Prince

  4. #4
    youre out of your element Marc's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Ireland
    Age
    26
    Posts
    2,128

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Valuable View Post
    Last night I had a lot of assignments to do for work so I decided to pop in some DVDs after Smackdown. A few days before I watched Orton/Cena from Summerslam 2009, Punk/Cena recently from RAW, as well as Orton/Christian from Smackdown. So last night I decided to watch some Ric Flair matches. I watched his epic battle with Ricky Steamboat from Wrestle War 1989. After that I watched those two again from their Spring Stampede Match in 1994.

    A few things stuck out to me:

    1. The matches from today's era are faster paced with more fluidity. While I enjoyed watching those two Flair/Steamboat matches it was obvious that the matches were slow paced, somewhat dragging on.

    2. The crowds are more emotionally involved in today's matches. The Flair/Steamboat match from 1994 was in Chicago (a vocal town always), but the crowd was dead for the whole match. The three matches I watched from today's era had the crowds completely into the match from bell to pinfall.

    3. Most important: the finishes in today's WWE are so much more convincing than the matches from years ago. Flair defeated Steamboat at WW 1989 with a lazy looking pinfall and in their 1994 match it ended with a controversial pin that came off flat, whereas the controversial pin from Cena/Punk from last year's match came off well. The finishes from the old days were very sloppy. One that comes to mind is when Flair defeated Race for the title at Starrcade.

    Most fans probably don't appreciate the match quality from today's WWE compared to years past. It seems like in any sport it's always hard to accept if something is possibly better now rather to then. Like a golf purist shooting down the idea of comparing Tiger Woods to Jack Nicklaus or a fan trying to argue that Lebron isn't in the same class as Michael Jordan -- fans like to cling on to the past while second guessing the present. For me I would much rather watch a 15-20 minute match than a 30 minute match that drags on to a sloppy finish.
    This I can't agree with at all, most matches today have the same crowd involvement as halftime heat.

  5. #5
    Banned Justin Valuable's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Frisco, TX
    Age
    28
    Posts
    6,412

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    My biggest problem with the matches from the past were the unconvincing finishes. For instance in Sting's two biggest wins over Ric Flair (Starrcade 89 and GAB) he beat Flair with a roll up/small package. Why couldn't he beat him with his finisher?

  6. #6
    Bosh! Coolstuff's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    England
    Age
    22
    Posts
    3,184

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Valuable View Post
    My biggest problem with the matches from the past were the unconvincing finishes. For instance in Sting's two biggest wins over Ric Flair (Starrcade 89 and GAB) he beat Flair with a roll up/small package. Why couldn't he beat him with his finisher?
    I like that. It leads to unpredictability in when the finish will be.
    Thanks too Fresh Prince

  7. #7
    Banned Justin Valuable's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Frisco, TX
    Age
    28
    Posts
    6,412

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    Quote Originally Posted by Coolstuff View Post
    I like that. It leads to unpredictability in when the finish will be.
    Yes it does, but WCW/NWA did this too often. I like a small package/victory roll to, but I like it executed well. Three of best involved Bret Hart (vs. Piper, vs. Owen, vs. Bulldog).

  8. #8
    MO to the G to the UNS! BadNewsFan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Seattle Washington
    Posts
    1,804

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    I actually wish more matches today would have random finishes like the old days.

    Finishers are too predictable and logically it doesn't make sense the guys would ever go for a cover after a basic move like a powerslam when they know only a finisher will get the job done.


    Shout out to Bender for the Bad Ass Bad News Banner!

  9. #9
    Moreoff than on Cereal Killer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Stuck inside my head
    Age
    39
    Posts
    3,836

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Valuable View Post
    My biggest problem with the matches from the past were the unconvincing finishes. For instance in Sting's two biggest wins over Ric Flair (Starrcade 89 and GAB) he beat Flair with a roll up/small package. Why couldn't he beat him with his finisher?
    Two words: Ric Flair. Kerry Von Erich didn't beat him with his finisher either. Back in the 80's, for Flair, it was I'll drop the belt, but the way I want to drop it. It was coming right back to him anyways.

  10. #10
    Banned Justin Valuable's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Frisco, TX
    Age
    28
    Posts
    6,412

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    Quote Originally Posted by Cereal Killer View Post
    Two words: Ric Flair. Kerry Von Erich didn't beat him with his finisher either. Back in the 80's, for Flair, it was I'll drop the belt, but the way I want to drop it. It was coming right back to him anyways.
    It hurt Sting that he didn't beat Flair with his finish. 4 of the biggest wins for Sting's career either had a random finish or a controversial win (two versus Flair and two versus Hollywood Hogan).

  11. #11
    Moreoff than on Cereal Killer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Stuck inside my head
    Age
    39
    Posts
    3,836

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Valuable View Post
    It hurt Sting that he didn't beat Flair with his finish. 4 of the biggest wins for Sting's career either had a random finish or a controversial win (two versus Flair and two versus Hollywood Hogan).
    I get that, but Flair and Hogan, at the time, didn't care. They didn't want their legacies tainted by tapping out.

  12. #12
    Lycanthrope Wolfman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Hell, NJ
    Posts
    768

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    You are so way off that it's sad. Crowds today completely suck because they expect fast-paced matches. They have zero patience. Wrestling in the 80's and 90's was way better because the matches actually TOLD A STORY. It's called professional wrestling. They actually wrestled back then. Today as soon as match slows down and they actually wrestle, the crowd starts chanting "Boring!". I agree there are still classic matches but in general, the product is poor and the WWE is aimed at kids. I give the OP a huge thumbs down and 100% disagree.

  13. #13
    Senior Member Jack Nichols's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    2,862

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    My biggest gripes against today's matches is they all seem to be wrestling the same match no matter whos in the ring. Of course wrestlers have the signature style moves, but the counters have gotten ridiculous to a point and are ruining the realism of matches. No wrestlers sell anything anymore. If you look at Savage, he sells a knee injury the entire match. Nowadays its sell the knee injury for a minute then back to running the ropes.

    I'd like to see wrestlers work their opponents 'injuries' more often. Heels should be using more heel tactics during their match and not just the end pulling the trunks, or Big E get on the apron to distract. Its all been done to death and needs to be reduced. I like simple heel tactics like a poke to the eye.

    Banner Credit: Spike

  14. #14
    Lycanthrope Wolfman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Hell, NJ
    Posts
    768

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    The other thing to mention are the wrestlers were so much more interesting and talented then a lot of the WWE "Superstars".

  15. #15
    Senior Member Baker223's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    1,951

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    The only thing I prefer about today's matches are they don't overuse DQ and Countout finishes. Way too many matches in the 80s and 90s ended that way.

  16. #16
    Senior Member LS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    22,510

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Valuable View Post
    2. The crowds are more emotionally involved in today's matches. The Flair/Steamboat match from 1994 was in Chicago (a vocal town always), but the crowd was dead for the whole match. The three matches I watched from today's era had the crowds completely into the match from bell to pinfall.
    I wouldn't say the crowds are that great during today's matches. And it's not even close to the reactions everything would get during the Attitude Era.

    The match quality today is great but unfortunately some of the best stuff in the past few years has been under the radar on Superstars, in FCW/NXT developmental, and the original NXTs.

    surrender

  17. #17
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    England
    Age
    26
    Posts
    512

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfman View Post
    You are so way off that it's sad. Crowds today completely suck because they expect fast-paced matches. They have zero patience. Wrestling in the 80's and 90's was way better because the matches actually TOLD A STORY. It's called professional wrestling. They actually wrestled back then. Today as soon as match slows down and they actually wrestle, the crowd starts chanting "Boring!". I agree there are still classic matches but in general, the product is poor and the WWE is aimed at kids. I give the OP a huge thumbs down and 100% disagree.


    Yeah.

    Too Cool were way more over than most main eventers are today.

    No idea what OP was thinking here.

  18. #18
    Senior Member LS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    22,510

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    Quote Originally Posted by GOAT View Post
    Too Cool were way more over than most main eventers are today.
    That is what was cool about past eras, there were tag teams, divas, and midcarders getting HUGE reactions for their matches and run-ins. You just don't get those same special reactions today.

    surrender

  19. #19
    Senior Member Greywolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Age
    23
    Posts
    5,559

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    I'm not going to say that today's matches are better. Because it's all a matter of opinion from the individual viewer. But personally, I enjoy today's matches better than any era.
    BELIEVE IN THE SHIELD
    Tyler Breeze will freeze your feed
    Cena fan for LIFE

  20. #20
    Lycanthrope Wolfman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Hell, NJ
    Posts
    768

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    Quote Originally Posted by GOAT View Post
    Yeah.

    Too Cool were way more over than most main eventers are today.

    No idea what OP was thinking here.
    Those guys sucked. I'm talking about the WWF/NWA in the 80's and early 90's.

  21. #21
    Senior Member Baker223's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    1,951

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    EDIT
    Last edited by Baker223; 03-23-2013 at 09:34 PM.

  22. #22
    Face of the WWE section Oncall's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Australia
    Age
    26
    Posts
    7,002

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    There have been some absolute classics in this era and week to week there are quality matches. I know there are classics in history but I really feel like there's some rose tinted glasses wearing going on. Look at Punks title defenses, notably his matches with Bryan. Sheamus/Bryan from extreme rules. I could go on and on and on.

    Credit to DC for the hometown hero trophy



    Quote Originally Posted by The Miz
    I'd rather you all hate me for everything I am then love me for something i'm not
    Quote Originally Posted by BigRed View Post
    Why don't you all just venture to Ohio and we can have one big, incestuous orgy.
    Winner of WWE Hometown Heroes at PW Mania X

  23. #23
    One More Match! Peepshow's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    England
    Age
    24
    Posts
    5,351

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    I am going to say something that is going to quite frankly piss alot of people off...selling body parts is fucking boring. There is nothing more boring about this business than watching a guy work a leg or a fucking arm.

    Del Rio working arms as a heel..fucking boring, Del Rio with a solid armbar finisher as a face...great wrestler.

  24. #24
    Senior Member Jack Nichols's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    2,862

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    I think todays matches lack a lot of the psychology and showmanship, but make up for it with athleticism and fast paced matches.

    Banner Credit: Spike

  25. #25
    Senior Member Vince Mcmahon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    4,451

    Default Re: The Matches Today Are Better

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Valuable View Post
    Last night I had a lot of assignments to do for work so I decided to pop in some DVDs after Smackdown. A few days before I watched Orton/Cena from Summerslam 2009, Punk/Cena recently from RAW, as well as Orton/Christian from Smackdown. So last night I decided to watch some Ric Flair matches. I watched his epic battle with Ricky Steamboat from Wrestle War 1989. After that I watched those two again from their Spring Stampede Match in 1994.

    A few things stuck out to me:

    1. The matches from today's era are faster paced with more fluidity. While I enjoyed watching those two Flair/Steamboat matches it was obvious that the matches were slow paced, somewhat dragging on.

    2. The crowds are more emotionally involved in today's matches. The Flair/Steamboat match from 1994 was in Chicago (a vocal town always), but the crowd was dead for the whole match. The three matches I watched from today's era had the crowds completely into the match from bell to pinfall.

    3. Most important: the finishes in today's WWE are so much more convincing than the matches from years ago. Flair defeated Steamboat at WW 1989 with a lazy looking pinfall and in their 1994 match it ended with a controversial pin that came off flat, whereas the controversial pin from Cena/Punk from last year's match came off well. The finishes from the old days were very sloppy. One that comes to mind is when Flair defeated Race for the title at Starrcade.

    Most fans probably don't appreciate the match quality from today's WWE compared to years past. It seems like in any sport it's always hard to accept if something is possibly better now rather to then. Like a golf purist shooting down the idea of comparing Tiger Woods to Jack Nicklaus or a fan trying to argue that Lebron isn't in the same class as Michael Jordan -- fans like to cling on to the past while second guessing the present. For me I would much rather watch a 15-20 minute match than a 30 minute match that drags on to a sloppy finish.
    1. This is a misconception somewhat because today there are a lot more star studded matches where its star vs. star. Of course with all this television something has to give. However, I don't think there is that much difference when you compare SNME/ppv matches from back then compared to now. Guys like Savage, British Bulldogs, HF, Steamboat. Pillman, Rockers, etc were in fast paced matches. The difference is that there were a lot more jobber matches in comparison and matches that were designed to build to ppv matches. For every Sin Cara match now with high flying there were Jushin Thunder Liger matches to compare back in the day too.

    2. I'm not too sure about this either as I think it is less. Show me today's product with bigger crowd reactions than matches like Rock/HHH where Rock won the title, Hart/Perfect at Slam 91 where the crowd was chanting "Let's Go Bret" or chanting "LOD LOD" when they won at MSG the titles from The Nastys. Both Eras have their points where the crowds are really into the matches. Look at the finish of Hogan/Andre and the crowd erupting when Hogan slams Andre.

    3. Again, it depends how you compare. You are watching those finishes today with years and years of the business upping the ante to get crowd reactions. It depends which matches you do the comparisons with. Using NWA/WCW in comparison to today WWF might be misleading as today the company is about entertainment, while that other company during that time was pushing a sport. You might want to do comparisons with wwe style as look at the finish of Hart/HBK at WM 12 with the draw and then overtime and the crowd's reaction. If that is not far enough back for a title match you should watch the reaction of Bob Backlund losing his title at MSG and the silence out of surprise to Iron Sheik.

    With that said all eras have some crap and greatness.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Oncall View Post
    There have been some absolute classics in this era and week to week there are quality matches. I know there are classics in history but I really feel like there's some rose tinted glasses wearing going on. Look at Punks title defenses, notably his matches with Bryan. Sheamus/Bryan from extreme rules. I could go on and on and on.
    Some really good matches, but some have rose tinted glasses because a lot of stuff happening now is forgotten rather quickly. Not sure it's the wrestlers fault as how the business doesn't give people a chance to let things sink in as in prior years.
    Who is the boss? Who made wrestling? Who is sports entertainment?

    WRESTLEMANIA 4 LIFE~~

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •